THREE man teams (2 frames each) - Proposals Scrapped!

[Alan Cunningham]

[This topic was originally titled Eight man teams but was renamed after it developed into a discussion about a three man team format]

I think we seriously have to re-consider this rule.
The likes of Cotgrave, Wollaton and Oakleigh ? who WERE the most most likely not to raise a full team are now regularly turning up with 8 players and seen disappointed that We and Pegasus 'B' are struggling to raise SIX. The SIX man team gets manipulated (not just in Div 2) so that player 1 & 2 also play in the pairs, which, against 'lesser' teams gives them 3 frames AND if the same happens with the other half of the team gives them the chance of 6 frames.
We, at Arnold, I presume the the same for Pegasus, entered the 'B' teams to give other lads the chance to play competitive snooker. We have on occasions (twice this season) had to play an 'A' player to make up our 6 man 'singles' team - but unfortunately last night that player was also needed to play in the pairs.
Should we, next season, revert back to the EIGHT man team system and stop 'A' team players playing for 'B' teams. This no doubt would mean the scapping of our 'B' team or conceding a lot of frames or asking for matches to be cancelled or conceded.
We all could of course change to a straight 6 man team with no doubles

[Mike Langdon]

I see your point Alan and numbers do appear to be up this year.  I am starting to phone up captains in advance to find out how many players they have so i can play 4 singles if possible like we did last week at City Hospice.  Personally i would like a whole change to the league to get rid of half the team going away whilst the other half stay at home and reverting to the institutes format of home one week away match the next.  My ideal format would be as follows:

NHSL Elite League (Teams of 3 players, 2 frames each) - this would create a real super league for only the finest players.
NHSL Divisions 1-3 - (teams of 4 players, one frame each)

As it stands teams like Wollaton with only 1 table can only enter 1 team in the current format whilst with this they would be able to enter 2 sides ie: the A team would be away whilst the B team were at home.  If this format was used i would be able to probably enter an Elite team + 3 other teams from Pegasus. Whilst at Arnold with only 3 tables you could enter the same amount quite comfortably.

Mike

[Alan Cunningham]

AT LAST, Whoopy dee, somebody on the same wave length as me. I have been envisaging this (Elite,Premier,Super League) for several seasons but have been shot down everytime, nobody wants to go forward. This would obviously mean that no higher grade player could play for a lesser grade team.
It would obviously cause problems when it came to Promotion & Relegation - as I have been told "we dont want a closed shop" - AND also with a blanket Nazareth House K.O. tournament, all the teams playing under a different format

[Mike Langdon]

Yep it would have to be it's own stand alone league with it's own cup competition. No promotion as such but teams could if they wish after winning the 1st division apply to join the Elite/Super League if obviously strong enough.   

[Alan Cunningham]

Super League - 3 man teams. What a League. Bulwell 'A', Bulwell 'B', Arnold 'A', Pegasus 'A', Beeston should all be able to put 2 teams in followed by Mapperley, Stadium & Phoenix (all the current 1st Division) thats at least 13 teams, I'm sure we could find another 3 to make up 2 divisions of 8.
That would leave the likes of Arnold 'B', Pegasus'B', Wollaton, Cotgrave, Lenton, City Hospital, University using the 4-man-team system in Div 3

[Robert Wright]

Hi Alun & Mike
Yes i can see where you are coming from but arn't you just creating another "institutes" league. I must say that i prefer playing home one week and away the next week. That's why i play in the institutes. If you play 3 players each playing 2 frames you would have to start at 7:30, not 8:00 as per NHSL. 3 frames at an average of 30 minutes a frame means that the matches wouldn't finish on one table teams till 11:00. Players do have work the next day and are not like you and me Alun. Retired! :sorry:
The reason the NHSL is unique is the format, and although it may be "tweeked" a little that's what it's all about.
I am pleased that the Rileys super league is starting up. It's not for me though as it's all about the money. Sorry but not interested as it's all about the game for me. I enjoy the playing of the game for the fun of it win or lose. When "money" is offered it distracts from the fun and after a few seasons where teams are winning everything and others not a bean teams will not enter as they haven't a chance of winning anything. It will be down to 3 or 4 teams and won't be worth running as a league. Isn't this what happened to the old super league.

[Alan Cunningham]

Hopefully ! ! ! , what with the quality of the snooker, I would have thought 20 mins a frame, which would be only 2 hrs. ALSO the majority of the team would have access to 2 tables. BUT then again, changing the rules ?, we could make them 7.30pm starts.

[Mike Langdon]

I'm gonna change my mind.  The league is stronger than for quite a few years and to be honest we have 4 sides who are more than capable of winning it (not many leagues can say that!) and an Elite league would be exactly the same 4 teams.  My main reason for proposing an Elite league was to see players playing two frames instead of one as the biggest moan appears to be about turning out for just 1 frame.

My personal view is that if we get rid of the pairs frame (which is always the longest frame) we could play 3 x 2 frame singles matches no problem between 8-11pm (probably 10:30) in the 1st Division and probably in the 2nd as well (perhaps we could try it one week and see how it goes).  If it gets to 10pm and the final match has not started then that match should use just 10 reds for both frames to ensure a finish.

I also beleive it could be done it the 2nd division but would try just the top division to start with.

My other reason for changing my mind is that yes i would prefer to see 3or4 man teams playing home one week and away the next but it would mean more captains willing to give up their time and sadly i don't see many of them out there.  I would be fearful of losing more players rather than C + D teams being started up.


So i guess stick with what we've got as it works but i would love to see a trial of the 2 frame match in the top division.


Another idea to perhaps give the home leg - away leg format a bit of spice is to award points on how you do at each venue.  3 points for a 4-0 win, 2 pts for a 3-1 and a point for a draw.  So for instance the Pegasus Phoenix match the other night would have finsihed 4points to 1 in Pegasus's favour (1 point away and 3 from the home leg)

Just an idea

Mike

[Alan Cunningham]

I'd still prefer to wave my flag and beat my drum and play the '3man x 2 frame' system - or keep the same number of teams as we have now '6man x 2 frame', home and way - AND get rid of the pairs.
If we are stick with the current format, players being allowed to play for each team, then they COULD be penalised with THEIR handicap

[Steve Howard]

bin reading intently to ur alans, & mikes comments, i know what you mean bout 'the biggest moan being turning out just for 1 frame',once we've had our 1 frame we just then play amongst ourselves,and the 'competitive' side in me,would prefer 2 frames of snooker,and it would be a boon playing the 3 man 2 frames system,as at phoenix generally i have 6 players regularly,tho' to find a guaranteed 8 most wks proves a right struggle,as some work nights and can only get 2 out of 4 games,and the most annoying thing for me,is when 1 or two of my team dont ring to let me know they're coming,and turn up minutes before the matches start.and,by then the teams chosen already.
so very constructive comments from both mike and alun,
so theirs my 'two penneth' guys,i prefer the 3 man 2 frame system,as its just that bit more worth coming out the house for,tho' i still come out for just one. :happy:
i know like alun says, that he like a few other teams struggle to find players to make up a team some weeks,so that would suggest leaning towards the 3 man system,wouldn't you agree??

[RHicks]

I think that I would be speaking for everyone at the Uni Snooker Club in saying that so far our debut season in the NHSL has been highly enjoyable. For us the best thing has been going to Snooker clubs all over Nott'm and playing frames in a competitive/friendly environment, meeting loads of great people. For example, some of us have gone down to Lenton Liberal Club and played there occasionally as it's easier to get to than our Sports Centre for most of us. We would never have known this place even existed without the league! I think this is the key feature of league and so any changes should not reduce the number of different clubs you get to go to. In our opinion there would be no need to change the format of the league as we can get the right number of people each week with little problem and having two tables in our Snooker room means the frames are all finished in good time (usually around 9-30). However every club is different (again this is the best feature of the league) and so I'd understand if not everyone agreed the league is fine as it is (like Alan!!). Another thing I would say is that a frame of snooker is a frame of snooker. Sure there is a small home advantage in knowing how your table plays, but it's not so great as to introduce an 'away goals' style rule. Away goals has got to be the worst rule in football and snooker would be better off without it!!

[Jordan]

I agree completely with R Hicks.

[Steve Butler]

I was bored and started daydreaming again!



30 teams!

I bet this wouldn't get voted in at the AGM!

:laugh: :drink: :laugh:

[Robert Wright]

I'D vote for it! whoops sorry i can't. :sorry: I would go even further and have 5 divisions of 3 players each playing 2 frames. That's a lot of teams.

[Daniel]

I'd still prefer to wave my flag and beat my drum and play the '3man x 2 frame' system - or keep the same number of teams as we have now '6man x 2 frame', home and way - AND get rid of the pairs.
If we are stick with the current format, players being allowed to play for each team, then they COULD be penalised with THEIR handicap

I agree with Alan but not just for the top division.  I bet you won't find many players who would not prefer to play 2 frames in a night, however that is worked.  Perhaps if you only have one table then keep the 3 plus pairs or 4 single frames for their home match, but the option of playing 3 players play 2 frames home and away (yes like the 6 red league)  makes it worth the effort.  You can also keep the 8 teams in a division then so we still get to meet lots of players/play at loads of clubs.

Failing that, I'd still be happy to play 3 players play 2 frames and have that as a whole team (3 men) and play home and away on alternate weeks.  In fact like R Wright says similar without mentioning the home and away element